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London Fire
#1
A horrific fire in the early hours of this morning in Grenfell Towers in London. Up to 50 hospitalised so far and propably multiple fatalities also:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-londo...25?SThisFB
We are the willing, led by the unknowning, doing the impossible, for the ungrateful.
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#2
Terrible reading this it's eerily reminiscent of the twin towers

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#3
Bloody hell

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JUST CALL ME PROBIE
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#4
Absolutely terrifying watching the incident unfold on nights! Amazing to have 200 fire service personel available. Especially when LFB have resisted repeated attempts to reduce their size and service by torries. The pure operation of fire fighting in a building of that size must be complex. Some of the pictures of the fire fighters this morning really shows the efforts ongoing over night have taken their toll. Kudos to them all!
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#5
(14-06-2017, 05:18 PM)coastguardsteve Wrote:  Especially when LFB have resisted repeated attempts to reduce their size and service by torries. 


Boris Johnson overseen the closure of 10 Fire Stations in London as recently as 2014.

The Tories have been pushing hard for fire station closures all over the UK.
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#6
600 firefighter jobs lost in London alone and the FBU say 10,000 all over the UK. Can't find a figure for station closures.
We are the willing, led by the unknowning, doing the impossible, for the ungrateful.
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#7
Fair enough, i remember stuff about closures when i lived there, but i hadnt known it happened. Madness really when an incident like this happens
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#8
Don't think if they had 2,000 fireman and not 200 at it would it have made a difference.
That building was lost in minutes and unless they were standing outside the building st the time, I doubt if they could have done more.
What appears to be combustible cladding, single stairs, crap fire alarm, no sprinklers and policy of telling residents to remain in their apartments instead of evacuating all combining to kill the residents.
God only knows what the final death toll will be but I think it could be really high.

The one thing I thought from an operational point of view that the LFB looked difficient in was the reach of their aerial appliances.
As far as I know they only have 30m TLs and 32m ALPs, so that's at best 12/13 floor , well short of the top floors.
In fact I read this evening that Surrey are sending the LFB their 42m ALP.
Hard to credit that the LFB have nothing taller than 32m .
An interesting bit of history though, it's 351 years since the Great Fire of London where only 6 deaths were recorded, but the Royal Fire Commisioners decreed that " no roofs nor buildings in London wilst be built nor covered with materials if that shouldst burn"
The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are filled with doubts while the stupid people are full of confidence...
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#9
Fireman just tweeted the sun this..... legend! I [Image: 89e581bcde1559b51d4454a82e0a06f1.jpg]
Whatever your reaching for better be a sandwich....coz your gonna eat it......
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#10
Mick = Legend!

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#11
Brilliant response by Mick.
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#12
His twitter account appears to be gone. I sincerely hope the powers that be didn't cause him grief over it.
We are the willing, led by the unknowning, doing the impossible, for the ungrateful.
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#13
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environm...1?mode=amp
We are the willing, led by the unknowning, doing the impossible, for the ungrateful.
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#14
Sure they'll just ask the senior fire adviser in the Dept. With his breathtaking knowledge of nationwide operational incidents and the wealth of fire investigation report's available he'll have all the answers.
We trained hard ... but it seemed that every time we were beginning to form up into teams we would be reorganized. I was to learn later in life that we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing; and a wonderful method it can be for creating the illusion of progress while producing confusion, inefficiency, and demoralization.
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#15
(15-06-2017, 06:05 PM)Command Support Wrote: His twitter account appears to be gone. I sincerely hope the powers that be didn't cause him grief over it.
He took it down himself because the volume of messages was overwhelming.
We trained hard ... but it seemed that every time we were beginning to form up into teams we would be reorganized. I was to learn later in life that we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing; and a wonderful method it can be for creating the illusion of progress while producing confusion, inefficiency, and demoralization.
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#16
The state of some of the "fire safety experts" being rolled out on the media has had me shaking my head a lot this week.

I've always said fire safety regulations seem to be based on what I call the "ten bodies" rule. Lanakal House didn't hit the magic number so very little happened- this one sadly has well exceeded it, so now we'll see improvements.

That said, external cladding fire risks in high rise are hardly a new phenomenon, it's been happening across Asia and the Middle East with regularity for a good few years now.

Good info on the mechanism of spread:
http://global.ctbuh.org/resources/papers...facade.pdf

http://www.tallbuildingfiresafety.com/do...-Fires.pdf
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#17
Good read that !
We trained hard ... but it seemed that every time we were beginning to form up into teams we would be reorganized. I was to learn later in life that we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing; and a wonderful method it can be for creating the illusion of progress while producing confusion, inefficiency, and demoralization.
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#18
Interesting again to hear it said that it will be up to the Fire Service to establish what caused the fire in London.

We must be one f the few fire services in the world without fire investigators.
The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are filled with doubts while the stupid people are full of confidence...
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#19
I reallyhope the firefighters involvedin this incident are looked after properly.

Quote:A firefighter who heard children's screams as he battled the Grenfell Tower blaze has described the fire as "like a warzone".

Damian Magee and other crew members from Whitechapel Fire Station's Red Watch were among the first firefighters dispatched in the early hours of Wednesday, as the emergency services were flooded with calls.

Mr Magee told Sky News he could see the blaze miles in the distance before nearing the tower, adding that he was "hoping and praying that it was a construction site, a new-build, that was going up".
The crew's progress was hampered by traffic and road blocks, forcing them to abandon their fire engine and run to the tower.
Describing the scene that confronted him, Mr Magee said: "I've never seen anything like this…it was like a movie.

"I had no idea how many people had got out by that stage, how many were trapped.

"There was screaming, children screaming, and other residents in the block."
He added: "Particularly I can remember a kid's voice that was at a higher pitch screaming for help.

"They probably had some hope that when they saw the fire brigade down there that we would get in and help them."

Mr Magee and his crew avoided falling debris as they battled their way in to the building, only to find conditions worse inside.

With heavy smoke filling the tower's corridors, the firefighter realised he didn't have enough oxygen to make it to the top.
He said: "There's no lift and 24 or 25 floors to run up with all the gear…you wouldn't be able to do the air we had.

"It was like a warzone, there was debris falling on cars, smoke everywhere, flaming debris as well.

"We were aware the place was filling up with more and more smoke, we were not supposed to be starting off in smoky environments but there wasn't a safe zone to go to."
Mr Magee revealed 999 operators dealt with up to 172 fire survival guidance calls, when a trapped person cannot leave their home and stays on the line.
He said: "We must have had the most horrendous night of dead lives.

"What we didn't achieve was terrible but I do know that everyone gave their all."

He added: "Our ladders only go so high, a human can only absorb so much heat before they combust.

"(Firefighters) gave way more than what we are trained to do or should have done."

Sky News
http://www.esforum.org - Home of the real emergency service personnel.

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#20
From Pete Drummond on Facebook.
Quote:Yesterday at 17:15 ·
Apologies to my Facebook friends who are probably fed up of posts with ref to the fire in London but I would just like to share a powerful and emotional account of one of the FFs who went into the fire. Its quite a long read but well worth it in my opinion. He has put into words what many couldn't......
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As always we were woken with a start, the lights came on and the automated tannoy voice started shouting our call signs. It never fails to set your heat racing. Getting dressed I looked at the clock, I'd only lay down less than a hour ago. Time to see what we've got this time..
Down the pole to the trucks and it's here I'm handed the call slip make pumps 25... what! No..
That's a big incident.
Wait.... I don't know where this is.. it's not on our ground.
We have to look it up and then we're out the doors.
We arrived about 0120hrs but due to the way cars are parked in the streets and the fire engines that are arriving with us we couldn't get closer than 4-5 streets away from the building. Other trucks were closer they would be setting up water ready for us.
We could see this was a bad one immediately. The sky was glowing. Leaving our truck we started quickly towards it. Picking up pace we are carrying our BA sets on our back, while making our way we are trying to read the conditions in front of us, trying to take in as much information as we could. How big is the tower, where is the fire, where is the fire going next, how's it behaving, how many flats are internally affected, how many people are in there?
We mustered outside the entrance. Parts of the building we already starting to fall down on to the surrounding area.
As we entered the building the fire on the outside was raging from the top to the bottom.
Walking up to the bridgehead on the 3rd floor we were told to look at a floor plan that had been hastily drawn on a wall.
We stood looking at it waiting at entry control to be given instructions my BA partner and I (a new mother herself) stood waiting with other firefighters waiting to see what information there was available. Then we received our brief... 23rd floor people stuck in their flat go!
23rd floor? I repeat back.. giving the flat number I received to the Watch manager.
She confirms. I turned at told my BA as the reality of how high we are going to try and go on a single cylinder of air.
Weighed down carrying 30kg+ of equipment not including our firekit and breathing apparatus (BA) we passed through entry control handing in our tallies and confirming our brief.
We made our way up a crowed stairwell struggling to make progress, at times unable to pass because of the amount of people on the stairs. The stairwells were full of other BA crews bringing people down all in various states and conditions.
The smoke grew thicker with each floor we went up. No proper floor numbers on the stairwells after about the 5th floor made it hard to know where you were. Someone before us had tried to write them on the wall with chinagraph pencil but this didn't last long. The dirty smoke was covering the walls with a film of blackness
Around the 9th floor we lost all visibility and the heat was rising. Still we continued up and up through the blackness. We reached what we believed to be the 19/20th floor but there was no way to tell. It was here where we found a couple trying to find their way out, panicking, choking, blinded by the thick toxic air.
A quick gauge check showed us that the amount of floors we'd climbed had taken its toll, we were getting low on air. There's no way we could make it to the 23rd and back to the bridgehead.
The couple were shouting and screaming at us through the coughing, trying to tell us there were 5 more people on the floor above!
Now I had horrible decisions to make and a very short amount of time to make them.
In what I think would of been less than a minute these are all the things I had going through my head.
I will list a few of them for you.
All of which I needed to consider before making my decision:........
•Now that we've stopped and lost our rhythm on the stairs would we have enough air to leave this couple and try to reach the next floor?
•Was the information we are getting from these people was correct. After all they are frantically panicking as they choke and suffer from the heat.
•If we let them carry on down the stairs alone would they or could they find their own way out?
•If we went up another floor would we actually find the 5?
•If we found them what state would they be in? Could the two of us get that many out especially one or more are unconscious?
•How would we decided who to take?
•Do we have enough air to make it back down to safety ourselves from where we are?
•Should I be considering asking my BA partner a "new mother" to risk even more than she already has...?
•Can I accept/live with the thought that saving two lives is better than taking the risk to go up and potentially saving no one?
Ahh!! Come on think...!
Am I doing enough?
Can I give more?
Am I forgetting any of my training....?
Stop....
Breath.....
Think.....
•Why haven't we seen another crew for so long?
•Will another crew find them?
•Are we really where we think we are?
•The radios are playing up... have we missed a important message.
•Have all crews been pulled out?
•Is the structure still safe?
Come on make a decision... and make it quick these people are choking.......
Ok Ok Ok!
Dam!
Come on!! Think!!
Right... ok
Decision made!
I do a double check... ask my partner...
Is it the right decision..?
Ahhh
I'm doubting myself,
Ahhh! there's no time for this!
Come on get on with it...
Right! Make the call!
I try to radio down to entry control.
"Alpha Control Priority!"......
No response....
"Alpha Control Priority!"
Still No response....
Where are they... what's going on?!?
"Alpha Control Priority!"
.....................
.....................
Did they answer... it's hard to tell.. the signal is all broken I think I can just about hear something.
"Alpha Control Priority!"
Alpha control responds...
"Go a head with priority over"
Are they talking to me I can't hear my call sign...
Pass the message
Alpha control.. Two casualties found approx 20th floor, crew now escorting them down, request another BA team be committed to reach flat on 23rd floor. Further traffic....
5 casualties are reported apparently trying to make their way out on the floor above. Over
Alpha control "Message received"
Were they talking to me it broke up again...
Ok we really need to get out.
Let's go!
Grab my arm.
Taking a casualty each we set off. Within two floors both of us had been pushed down one of the flight of the stairs by our casualties. They are screaming at us that they couldn't breath.
We try to reassure them.
Stay with me!!
We are going to get you out!!.
Please stay with me!
Down and down we go... I hear a shout from behind me from my partner, the female casualty has become unconscious. My partner is now having to drag her down alone. I can't help at this time.
Two floors later we find another crew making their way out. One of them is carrying a little girl. I hand off my casualty to the firefighter who has a free set of hands, please take him out I shout, we'll be right behind you.
I turn to go but with that he hands me something I'd not seen initially.
Wait!
What!
Im handed a firefighters helmet!
This can't be good!!
Why does he have this?
Where is the firefighter it belongs too!
As I turn round and go back up one turn of the stairs I see him.
He's missing his helmet but he's with my BA partner.
He's got no helmet and no breathing apparatus.
Are you ok? Where's your BA set!?
He's given it to a casualty.. he's coughing as he tells us, he's delirious from the heat and smoke.
Still he tries to help carry the casualty! Helping others is still his first thought.
I shout at him.. Get down those stairs, get down to the bridgehead!
I take the casualties arms my BA partner has her legs.
We start down again.. round and round we go, hear the noise of crews working hard around us. There are still crews going up the stairs past us.
My BA pre alarm starts going this off.... this means one thing.. my air is running low.. similar noises are all around me.
Turning a corner we see a white helmet, it's a watch manager in the stairwell we've reach the bridgehead.
It's moved again. It's now up on the 5th floor.
My partner takes the firefighter with no BA in to the 5th floor lobby to administer Oxygen.
The watch manager takes the casualties legs from her.
Walking backwards down another 5 floors and finally I'm on the ground floor but I can't stop yet. I hand the casualty over. Then I'm off back up those stairs to the 5th floor.
Reaching entry control, now finally I can shut my set down and I take my mask off. Hoping for a deep breath of clean air...
ah nope!!
It's not clean air in here, I suck in lung full of light ish smoke. It makes me cough and retch.
Still It's clean enough to breath I guess. It's better than the air higher up.
With my tally collected I find my BA partner. She's with the firefighter we found and she's administering him Oxygen. We're off. We take him down and out with us.
As we get outside we are desperate for a drink of water, collapsing on the grass by the leisure centre. Someone see us and throws us some water I drink it straight down, its gone so fast it barely touches the thirst I have.
As I look up colleagues are all around us, tunics off their t-shirts soaked through with sweat, no one really able to talk.
All of us sat there looking at the building we've just come out of. It's worse now! The fire is everywhere and fierce!
It's hard to comprehend we were just in there.
We see a man in a high window trapped in his flat, we can hear the radio traffic. They know he's there but no one can get to him... but crews are working hard trying to help him.
He's there for a long time disappearing then coming back.
Slowly we catch our breath, we service our BA sets new oxygen cylinders on them we are ready to go again.
Recovering I go to find more water. At a cordon a woman pleads with me... crying and pushing her phone at me she says she has her friend on line.
Her and her baby are trapped on the 11th floor.
It throws me... I struggle to reply.. I look across at a police officer I point at him and tell her he will take her to the people who will take her friends information and pass it on to the crews inside.
Stay on the phone with her I say!
Tell her not to give up!
We are still coming.
We are still getting to people I promise.
No time to stop, don't get distracted. I've got to get a drink and get back to it.
Time passes quickly, some people are given jobs while others have to wait to be tasked with going back inside.
Some time later I couldn't say how long we are all grouped together waiting for news. A senior officer is telling us he knows we've already broken all the policy's we have. He knows the risks we've taken but thats not enough we are going to have to take more! There are still a lot more people who need us.
He says he's going ask us to do things that would normally be unimaginable. To put our lives at risk even more than we already have.
Everyone is looking round at each other listening to this officer try to motivate us into action again. He didn't need to though
we are ready for it! This is what we train for.
Those colleagues who a little while ago were collapsed and broken from on the grass from their first entry are back up, ready, stood in full kit waiting for their orders to go in again.
Now lots of things happened during the time I was outside. Some people were rescued alive, some unfortunately weren't. People jumped, a mother threw a baby from a floor high up, caught by a complete stranger arms just so she could get it away from the fire.
All this time hour after hour my colleagues were pushing themselves above and beyond what you'd think was humanly possible.
As the light broke and time passed we knew it had gone to make pumps 40, and that 20 relief trucks were ordered. So as the trucks with fresh crews arrived those of us that were there early on were starting to be swapped over. We were told to find our crews and go to the debrief but no one was wanting to leave each and every one willing to give more, but eventually we all had to leave the scene.
So 19 hours after starting our night shift the members of Red Watch made it back to the Fire Station.
Time to try and rest.. in 4 hours time we will be on duty again.
We hand over the appliance to the Blue Watch. Tell them what equipment we known to be missing.
I swapped out my dirty fire gear so I'm ready for 8pm, I might as well do it while I'm still covered in sweat and dirt.
I shower, but the smell of smoke won't go away. I wash three times and give up.
I'm beyond tired but I cant sleep.. there's to much going on in my head.
I think I need a drink!
I go out to the local pub with colleagues. I order a shandy, I'm back on duty soon.
As we sat with our drinks we don't really talk. Sitting in almost complete silence, each lost in thought trying to begin to process everything that's happened. Yet we are aware of the people all around us laughing and joking with friends, enjoying their drinks in the sun. Oblivious to what we've seen, unaware of what we've been doing all night.
I've no appetite but I know I need to eat. We go to and get some food but it's hard to concentrate.
We go back to the fire station, there's no time to get home. I find a bed in the dorm room and eventually manage 45 min sleep before I wake up. Wash my face, get dressed and I'm ready to report for roll call, ready to do it all again.
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Now... this is only a small part of the things we saw and did on that night. Other stories will obviously come out but some won't. Some will be kept by firefighters and the other emergency services hidden away deep down in their thoughts, never to pass in to words, never to be told to a living soul but always there, those emotional scars will forever be there.
 
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