RSA gives some good advice
#1
Sometimes acting with the best of intentions can be the worst thing you could do for injured road users

RSA EXPERT ADVICE
August 8 2018 2:30 AM






I was recently contacted by a member of the fire service.
He wanted us, the RSA, to consider running a campaign on what people should and shouldn't do when they come across a road traffic collision.
The firefighter was prompted to call because he had been coming across instances of good Samaritans who have no or little training, such as community cardiac responders, first aiders etc.
These well-meaning people would have been first at the scene.
The firefighter said, however, that they were pulling casualties out of vehicles and onto the road.
While they think they are helping and are doing this with the best of intentions, they could end up causing even greater injury.
My caller gave an example.
His fire tender was sent to attend a crash involving a motorcycle.
Before they arrived, a local community cardiac responder had come across the scene.
On his own he proceeded to remove the casualty's helmet.
This is something you should never do because of the risk of aggravating a possible spinal injury.

Luckily, on this occasion, there was no injury involved, nor were the injuries he received exacerbated by the actions of our good Samaritan.
But, in truth, he was lucky.
When the firefighter spoke to him, he could not understand why, as a cardiac responder, he should not have done it, saying it was just a helmet.
Of course, it's not just a helmet, and it's important not to remove it from an injured motorcyclist.
Leave that to the trained professionals.
As the firefighter told me himself: "If the message of 'talk but don't touch unless you have to' could be put across it may do some good."
If you are the first on the scene of a crash, you have a duty to firstly call the emergency services.
You can call them on 999 or 112.
You will be put through to the national 999 call-handling centre.
The first question you will be asked is: 'Which emergency service do you require?'
You will have to choose either the gardaí, fire brigade or ambulance service.
You will then be put through to the call handling centre for that emergency service.
You will be asked a series of questions about where the collision happened, how many people and vehicles are involved and whether anyone has been injured. Finally, you will be asked for your details.
In collisions where people are killed or injured, you can expect to be asked additional questions. This is to make sure that enough responders are dispatched as soon as possible.
If you are first to arrive at the scene of a crash, there are some dangers of which you need to be aware.
The risk from passing traffic, the location of the crash - on a dangerous bend. Is it at night? These are the most obvious.
Dangers posed by vehicles involved in the crash itself and those that have shed their loads are others.
While waiting for the emergency services, you may be able to help make the scene safe, while not endangering your own safety.
You might have to decide between attending to the injured and making the scene safe.
Try to share these responsibilities. If there are others, two of you should move away from the scene in opposite directions to warn approaching motorists.
If you have a torch or high-vis jacket, use them to help you do this job more safely.
If you have a car, turn on your flashing warning lights to warn oncoming drivers, preferably at opposite ends of the scene.
In general make those injured as comfortable as possible and try to reassure them.
Let them know that help is on the way. Be discreet. Don't say anything within earshot of those injured which might be negative.
When the emergency services arrive, make yourself known to them immediately and give them as much information as possible.
Ask if you should remain at the scene. If people are injured the gardaí will probably need to take witness statements.

SOURCE
#2
Good advice and no harm to give the public some guidence
Those who can, do.

Those who can't do, teach.

Those who can't do or teach....... Manage!
#3
Motorcyclists used to have to wear "do not remove in event of accident" stickers on their helmets. Sad to see that people trained in some level of first aid do not know this basic rule.
I still remember my last big road based crunch on the bike. Back when you had an ambulance driver and a nurse. Bike had hit me at some point between me parting company with it and bouncing between road and ditch. Helmet was visibly damaged as I was helped (walking) into back of ambo. I had ear plugs in and couldnt hear the questions they were asking me. 
Nurse let me take my own helmet off. Best idea in the circumstances.
#4
(09-08-2018, 09:21 PM)Dirtyshirt72 Wrote: Motorcyclists used to have to wear "do not remove in event of accident" stickers on their helmets. Sad to see that people trained in some level of first aid do not know this basic rule.
I still remember my last big road based crunch on the bike. Back when you had an ambulance driver and a nurse. Bike had hit me at some point between me parting company with it and bouncing between road and ditch. Helmet was visibly damaged as I was helped (walking) into back of ambo. I had ear plugs in and couldnt hear the questions they were asking me. 
Nurse let me take my own helmet off. Best idea in the circumstances.

one or two of our blood bikers still wear them stickers + 1 wears his blood type on his chest
Volunteers Are Unpaid , Not Because They Are Worthless. But Because They  Are Priceless !!!
#5
My marshal group wear blood group on our chest too. You never know.
#6
Just being Devils Advocate here.....if you have one of those stickers. If you have one on and it’s actually needed, it probably means you’re unconscious. Which means you can’t protect your own airway. Dunno....I think if I was a biker I’d take my chances instead of filling my airway and/or helmet with blood and/or vomit....
It's not the HSE's opinion, it's not managements opinion, it's mine. All mine.
#7
Echo may correct me as its been a good few years since I worked in a hospital

But I'm pretty sure anyone would just get O Neg until a type and screen is done then the appropriate blood type and rhesus factor would be issued

A type and screen is only valid for something like 72hrs. Issuing of blood is highly regulated with a fair bit of paperwork and traceability involved. A&E and theatre usually have a stock of O neg for emergencies
JUST CALL ME PROBIE
#8
(14-08-2018, 10:50 AM)EMTeabreak Wrote: Echo may correct me as its been a good few years since I worked in a hospital

But I'm pretty sure anyone would just get O Neg until a type and screen is done then the appropriate blood type and rhesus factor would be issued

A type and screen is only valid for something like 72hrs. Issuing of blood is highly regulated with a fair bit of paperwork and traceability involved. A&E and theatre usually have a stock of O neg for emergencies

I was thinking the same.... not sure any doctor would infuse a specific type of blood based on a sticker on a biker's jacket. 


Biker helmet is definitly a difficult one..... obviously A comes before c. If they can take off themselves get them to do that..... 

The new CPGs are certainly allowing for more common sense approach to spinal motion restriction. I have walked patients out of cars and into the ambulance that before may have had "immobilization".  i also took the "immobilization" off a biker (after i assessed them)who came off his bike and had been immobilised before we arrived.
#9
Saw that article on the cfr facebook page.
Personally i think some cfrs in dublin are not sure what their role is, not event medics, not emergency service etc. (I'm cfr instructor)
Not sure why the article focussed on cfr.
Had a head on rtc car flip during the week and after checking both cars to see what i had i then went back to car number 1 to find local volunteer order of malta...getting involved.... part of me appreciated he'd stopped while another wanted him to get out of my way as i went through the basics knowing dfb would be on scene in less that 5 minutes.
I'd have preferred if they had at least approached me first.

As for blood type...yep we're not in a battlefield...no big issue. Helmet removal..tough call. Theres always the what if they cant breath.
#10
In relation to helmet removal people panic and rush to get it off, open the visor first and see if the person is conscious / breathing. There hasn’t been incidents of CFR groups providing event cover that’s really outside their role and training. 

In fairness the OMAC lad was doing his best to help and was freeing you up for policing side if all was good. Regardless of how far away DFB are an extra pair of trained hands is always good
Those who can, do.

Those who can't do, teach.

Those who can't do or teach....... Manage!
  


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